Timeline for Is cycling on this 35mph road too dangerous?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
29 events
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| Jan 25, 2021 at 8:56 | comment | added | Leherenn | @Criggie Well it's not the same stretch of road, so I do not know whether it applies. Also the existing answers are pretty good I think. It was more to add an anecdote on the "can you legally cycle there". | |
| Jan 23, 2021 at 0:27 | comment | added | Criggie♦ | @Leherenn that specifically is a good answer, and you should post it as an answer because it contains relevant local knowledge. You know how SE works. | |
| Jan 23, 2021 at 0:05 | comment | added | Criggie♦ | Remember comments are for corrections and clarifications. You can post your own answers too. | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 15:28 | comment | added | Leherenn | I've cycled from Waikiki to Koko Crater when I visited. For a long stretch you have no choice but to take H-72, the road signs explicitly mention this is the way for bicycles. It's not very confortable and there is a lot of garbage (esp. bits of tyre) on the shoulder, but it's certainly doable. Not sure I'd like to do it every day though. | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 13:31 | comment | added | cmaster - reinstate monica | @Peter-ReinstateMonica That depends on the speed of the cars. If the cars are driving 100km/h, you are 100% right, and even I would rather squeeze on the shoulder. However, when the cars are only allowed to do 50km/h, their approach to you looks to them like the approach to a parking car when driving 30km/h. I don't hear much of people driving into parked cars in 30km/h roads... | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 12:41 | comment | added | Peter - Reinstate Monica | @cmaster-reinstatemonica At the risk of having insufficient longitudinal distance though which typically leads to grave injury or death ;-). | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 12:36 | comment | added | cmaster - reinstate monica | @Peter-ReinstateMonica As such, taking the lane is the only possibility for a bike to enforce sufficient lateral distances to trucks. | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 12:35 | comment | added | cmaster - reinstate monica | @Peter-ReinstateMonica Yes, laws differ, and the wording of "as near to the right-hand curb" is indeed evil. However, note the words "suitable" and "as practicable". A "shoulder bikeway" that does not provide for sufficient safety distances is simply not usable, and thus neither "suitable" nor "practicable". From the image, I deduce that the shoulder is no more than 2m wide. If I assume a 3.5m lane, a 2.5m truck is 0.5m away from the line. In my country, trucks need to pass bikes with at least 2m distance, so the bike would need to scratch the wall on the right. That's not practicable. | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 12:02 | comment | added | Peter - Reinstate Monica | @cmaster-reinstatemonica Here is the law for Hawaii: "Every person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at such time shall ride as near to the right-hand curb, on the edge of the roadway, or on the shoulder off of the roadway as practicable..." (emphasis mine). | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 11:56 | comment | added | Peter - Reinstate Monica | @cmaster-reinstatemonica E.g. from oregon.gov/odot/Engineering/Documents_RoadwayEng/…: "Shoulder Bikeway: A shoulder bikeway is a paved shoulder that provides a suitable area for bicycling, reducing confl icts with faster moving motor vehicle traffi c. Most bicycle travel on the rural state highway system, and on many county roads, is accommodated on shoulder bikeways." In the text, this is opposed to dedicated bike lanes, so it's indeed the unmarked shoulder. Obviously other states may have different rules, as always. | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 11:47 | comment | added | Peter - Reinstate Monica | @cmaster-reinstatemonica Of course you should ride on the shoulder. It would be insane not to. | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 11:46 | comment | added | Peter - Reinstate Monica | @GageMartin In many states it's totally allowed to ride a bicycle on a freeway, even if it seems absurd. See wikipedia, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-motorized_access_on_freeways. Due to a wide breakdown lane it may be actually safer than on some standard highways with no good shoulder, except at on/off ramps which are hard to negotiate properly (e.g. you should officially exit and re-enter instead of crossing the lane, but will you?). | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 6:25 | comment | added | Criggie♦ | @kkm thank you - you're totally welcome to add an answer of your own too. | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 6:24 | history | edited | Criggie♦ | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Jan 22, 2021 at 3:24 | comment | added | kkm mistrusts SE | @Criggie, you may also add to your already excellent answer that the same Google Maps website has a bicycle map mode, where dedicated bike paths, dedicated lanes and bike-friendly roads are marked. I found it a very helpful planning tool. Here's an example map with all 3 types of highlight: goo.gl/maps/jAD9QvpbtCtmvyYw5 | |
| Jan 22, 2021 at 3:07 | comment | added | kkm mistrusts SE | US states vehicle codes usually call mostly any paved road a "highway," while the "freeway" is a roadway with entry and exit lanes (and often ramps) and no intersections, lights or stop signs, hence "free" way (NY/NJ call them "turnpikes"). In CA, bicycles are illegal on freeways except where posted otherwise. I know of only one ~2mi stretch of 101 in SLO with the posted exception allowing bicycles on the shoulder. Someone was killed by a car there the other year. It's a nasty experience anyway: the shoulder is full of debris, and the traffic noise is deafening. | |
| Jan 21, 2021 at 14:35 | comment | added | user3067860 | @Criggie A lot of places just use signs. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-motorized_access_on_freeways (In my state they have slightly different wording, but basically the same...there's a sign at every on-ramp to the "highway"... Also commonly prohibits pedestrians, powered equipment like lawn mowers, etc. Basically everything without a license plate.) | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 23:49 | comment | added | GageMartin | @Criggie Maybe the most concise answer is just that there are many highways that are not freeways. The one you have included in your post with the bike lane is definitely not a freeway. To me it is unclear if the road from the OP's picture is a freeway but it is possible it is. | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 23:48 | comment | added | GageMartin | @Criggie it is a good question and why I tried to add a comment to clarify. I think the terminology in the US is confusing especially if you aren't located here. A "freeway" is specifically a road for high speed travel ~60mph but maybe a little lower in urban areas and not intersections only on/off ramps. A "highway" could mean that the road is part of the state or federal "highway system" and has a number but also can just be used colloquially for "busy/main road". | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 23:30 | comment | added | Weiwen Ng | @Criggie Good question. I think that in the US, "freeway" or "interstate highway" is a road that's designed for motor vehicles only with very high speeds. I didn't actually grow up in the US, but "highway" may be conceptually distinct here, whereas other countries might treat all those as synonyms. The interstates typically have speed limits of 60mph/100kph and higher, whereas the county highways may be 40-50mph/65-80kph. But never mind that, bicycles are allowed on the (wide) shoulders of county highways. | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 20:58 | comment | added | Criggie♦ | @GageMartin does "highway" in the name mean its a highway? I can't reconcile my random streetview find of a highway with a bike lane when cycling on a highway is prohibited by law. | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 20:32 | comment | added | Mike Ounsworth | Great point about "where can you bail to if something goes wrong?" | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 19:28 | comment | added | The Photon | Agreeing with @GageMartin, although I don't know about Hawaii specifically, in most of the western US, "freeway" is a synonym for "limited access highway", and "highway" includes any nationally, state or county designated road (and in a broader definition, pretty much any publicly accessible road). In California there are even some stretches of freeway that are legal for cycling because of limited alternate routes (for example: the Richmond-San Rafael bridge) | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 15:41 | comment | added | GageMartin | I'm not a lawyer and don't know about Hawaii specifically but in general in the US freeways vs highways mean different things when talking about where bikes are "allowed". Typically speaking a "freeway" will be a limited access road (no intersections just on/off ramps) while a highway is a much broader class of "big" roads that someone has decided to number. Some highways may even be suitable for cycling (not just allowable) | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 13:13 | comment | added | Criggie♦ | @WeiwenNg I read that each state has its own laws about highway/motorway cycling. And the degree of enforcement varies across counties too - each of which have their own separate police forces. | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 12:14 | comment | added | Dan K | I’ve ridden on much smaller shoulders and had no issues, it’s totally dependent on OPs confidence levels. In the UK you can ride on almost any road apart from motorways and almost on every bike lane you find bus tops or massive pot holes. Sometimes you are better off in the lane and give the shoulder a wide berth. | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 12:05 | comment | added | Weiwen Ng | In rural areas of the US, it is OK to cycle along county highways. Lots of cyclists do it. The thing is, traffic volume is low, the road is wide, and the shoulder is wide. This is just to illustrate that correct, highways may have different regulations in different parts of the US, and context matters a lot to safety. | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 11:00 | comment | added | cmaster - reinstate monica | I'd say that the shoulder of the road is largely irrelevant in the OP's case: Correct behavior would be to take the rightmost lane, the shoulder is obviously not built to be used. There's ample amount of lanes for cars to get around you, and taking the lane stops them from overtaking on very close quarters. Also, a speed difference of maybe 20mph (30km/h) is low enough that car drivers have all the time in the world to slow down appropriately if they cannot switch lanes immediately. However, cars are very likely to be speeding heavily on this road, so another route is by far the best option. | |
| Jan 20, 2021 at 9:42 | history | answered | Criggie♦ | CC BY-SA 4.0 |